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* THE FORUM FOR ALL THOSE INTERESTED IN BUILDING AND OPERATING MODEL SUBMARINES *



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*2021 AND SOME EVENTS ARE BEING PROPOSED. Keep them coming and let us know the details! (amstreasure@googlemail.com)

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Model Sub Weekend, 28th, 29th August. Bluewater Parkway, Greenhithe, DA9 9

Bournville Sub Day. Sept 2021 is looking likely. More details TBA.

Barrow in Furness Regatta and Sub day. Maybe in Sept 2021. Details TBA.

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Latest topics

» GRP end caps
30min epoxy EmptyTue Jul 20, 2021 9:31 am by david f

» WW2 mini sub build
30min epoxy EmptyTue Jul 20, 2021 9:15 am by david f

» Good 3D beginner's tutorial
30min epoxy EmptyFri Jul 16, 2021 3:14 pm by david f

» Looking for drawings and instructions for Hegi U-25 Kit
30min epoxy EmptyThu Jul 15, 2021 1:25 am by Telusboats

» Merit 1/35 X craft
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» UHF radio control for submarines (openLRS, LoRa, FSK etc. on 458Mhz and 433Mhz )
30min epoxy EmptyMon Jul 05, 2021 10:43 am by david f

» The workings of a sheer line submarine
30min epoxy EmptyWed Jun 30, 2021 9:03 am by subkraft

» Bonjour from France.
30min epoxy EmptyMon Jun 28, 2021 1:43 pm by Tobyledog

» Underwater navigation using UHF ?
30min epoxy EmptyFri Jun 25, 2021 5:46 pm by SimonH

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    30min epoxy

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    rgj
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    Post  rgj Wed Feb 22, 2012 9:19 am

    Hi

    A simple question from a newbie.

    Is a 30min epoxy eg ZAP30 sufficiently waterproof to glue small items eg hatches to the deck? I have had a quick scoot around a range of websites & get conflicting views.

    I look forward to your opinions

    ATB
    Rob
    david f
    david f
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    Post  david f Wed Feb 22, 2012 10:45 am

    I think it depends on the application. Is it "sink your boat" or just "**** its fallen off".

    I wouldn't use anything other than 24 hour epoxy for critical items
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    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Post  Tom(ADMIN) Wed Feb 22, 2012 11:37 am

    I agree with David, some of the quicker 5 minute epoxy glues may be quick and convenient to use, but their long term sticking power isn't that good.

    Some of the cheap pound shop epoxy glues are a bit suspect as well, as I discovered a couple of days back. I definitely wouldn't use the cheap glues for underwater use, and I'd be careful of using the 5 minute epoxy glues. I know it can be a pain in the proverbial, but for critical joints, then go for the 24 hour Araldite every time. It's safer in the long run...
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    rgj
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    Post  rgj Wed Feb 22, 2012 5:59 pm

    Thanks

    I will go for a long curing type

    ATB
    Rob
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    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Post  Tom(ADMIN) Wed Feb 22, 2012 6:09 pm

    You won't regret it...plus you get plenty of time to adjust things, get things positioned correctly, etc.
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    rgj
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    Post  rgj Mon Mar 05, 2012 1:45 pm

    Being of a scientific bent - I glued two off cuts of plastic together using ZAP30 & left them in water on the windowsill. Soggy & adhesion gone in 14 days.

    next experiment - 2 hours immersion twice a week & drying in between.

    While I was doing this I also got an email from the company who stated water resistant not proof and suggested :

    AnchorTite Waterproof Epoxy

    I have not found a UK supplier

    ATB
    ROb


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    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Post  Tom(ADMIN) Mon Mar 05, 2012 1:50 pm

    Now that's interesting, Rob...I've never heard of AnchorTite epoxy, it didn't appear when I did a Google search for it either. I will ask in my local DIY/Sell Everything and Anything/ shop next time I'm in there, if anyone will know of it, then that chap will.
    salmon
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    Post  salmon Mon Mar 05, 2012 4:59 pm

    Try this site:
    http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/SUPER-GLUE-Epoxy-Adhesive-6KWE3


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    Post  rgj Mon Mar 05, 2012 5:35 pm

    Thanks

    I have emailed the UK contact- I will let you know the outcome

    ATB
    ROb
    david f
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    Post  david f Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:25 am

    And good that you have done some actual testing.

    Much better than "stories" although I liked the one about Brian A's sub in a warm swimming pool (it was being filmed) that started to shed bits after an hour or so. The warm water was melting and dissolving the rapid epoxy.

    David
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    rgj
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    Post  rgj Tue Mar 06, 2012 9:20 pm

    I have recieved the following from the company - great service.

    No good for the wooden deck on U177

    ATB
    Rob

    Hello,



    I forwarded your email to one of our distributors who is well versed in using our glues in the hobby industry. In terms of using the Zpoxy for the hull of a boat model he wrote: “It is suitable if the hull of the boat is coated with two coats of Zpoxy finishing Resin, Over the 5 minute or 30 minute Zpoxy. Not sanded between coats, just sand the final coat, prime and paint.”



    I asked him about full immersion into water for a submarine model. However, we don’t have much experience with this application and he wrote: “I suspect it would be waterproof, as long as there is NO raw wood subject to water. If water can get to any raw wood, it will seep under the resin and delaminate it.”



    At this time we do not have a product that has been tested for the application you are interested in.



    Best Regards,

    Susie Brown

    Marketing Manager

    Pacer Technology




    nigele(ADMIN)2
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    Post  nigele(ADMIN)2 Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:36 pm

    I dont very often use epoxy for bonding and I would never use 30min epoxy,I saw a type seven U boat built with 30min epoxy fall to bits in a swiming pool some years ago,I bond most things on a GRP hull with gel coat or resin after all thats what the boat is made off.
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    Post  rgj Wed Mar 07, 2012 10:16 am

    The reason I asked the question is that the Engel instructions suggest using 1 hr epoxy in some areas a model shop recommended the product I asked about. Yet experienced modelers say not to (as you do). A clear dichotomy of opinion.

    Also at least one epoxy is sold as waterproof but feedback on Amazon says not the case which is then contradicted by another customer.

    Having a scientific background I set up a controlled experiment - & contacted the supplier. I now have answers based on my own observation & the manufacturers recommendation.

    Hopefully this will be of use to others rather than the "stories" that David describes

    ATB
    Rob

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    Post  Giovanni LiCalsi Wed Mar 07, 2012 7:05 pm

    You can use Zap Goo in some areas since it remains flexible and also makes a very good sealer. This makes it easier to remove a part for modifications in the future.
    Gelcoat resin is the best method but there are alternatives to everything and as long as you rough up the fiberglass surface and make sure that there is no remaining mold release left on any surfaces, most any epoxy over 30 minutes will adhere perfectly.

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