PCB DesIgns

Hi All,

Been a busy couple of months and learning alot (head hurts) arduino/cad and now PCB Designing.

Brought a 3d printer and loving it. Found you can convert it to be a cnc mill and plotter so thought i would give a go at printing my own boards as mine stripboard as not nice to see lol.

its only a basic layout but thought i give it a go. Off to maplin on the weekend to buy the fluid and boards.





Hopefully this will help in future builds.

please let me know if i draw then wrong if it there's a better way to do them.

cheers
tim

Hi Tim.
That looks really good!

I didn't know that 3D printers could also do this. How is it done??

I have made PCBs by the etch method and it is rather laborious and messy for one-off boards. This method looks to have a lot of potential for us.

I don't know what software you are using for the design? (I used Eagle some years back.)

You have made the board quite spacious which can be good for we amateurs. ( Don't forget to make the copper lands bigger if they are carrying much current.)

David

Thanks David, still getting my head round it so hopfully make it smaller.

I got the idea from the videos on youtube and a perminment marker.


Been using Fritizing and design spark to make them. with this it makes the 3d more usefull. will see how it comes out on the weekend.

Cheers

This is interesting! I will be looking forward to your updates.

I see!

I suppose I was hoping to avoid an etching step but you would need a CNC mill to do that?

Which raises the question (looking at my limited bench space) can you get 3D printers which also have a milling attachment? Nice to have the ability to "giveth AND taketh away".

I see that the video shows an etch resistant pen. I wonder if you could deposit a thin layer of plastic on the copper? Could avoid problems of the etchant getting under the resist and could provide a dimple for the drilling operation. (I seem to remember breaking quite a few drills!)

Very interesting!

David

Hi David,

quick answer i yes. there also dremel designs you can print off.

Having a issue with the printing at the moment as the pen hold is so far away from the print head it keep drawing off the table.

will not let this beat me :)

david f wrote:I see!

I suppose I was hoping to avoid an etching step but you would need a CNC mill to do that?

Which raises the question (looking at my limited bench space) can you get 3D printers which also have a milling attachment? Nice to have the ability to "giveth AND taketh away".

I see that the video shows an etch resistant pen. I wonder if you could deposit a thin layer of plastic on the copper? Could avoid problems of the etchant getting under the resist and could provide a dimple for the drilling operation. (I seem to remember breaking quite a few drills!)

Very interesting!

David

i too was curious if it was possible... i find that this guy seems to know what he is doing when it comes to 3d printers... so i would pattern my conversion after his...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDz1A1XDOt8&t=134s

totally agree. I think the idea will work out for the 3d printer but thinking dont what to damage it by putting extra stress from milling. I like th idea of the t8 cnc mills. about the same price as the 3d printer and built to do the job

So gone back to basics and use tonner and iron. printed two board now, first one came out really well but i made the signal track too thin and rubbed off. the 2nd one was alot better but i don't think i cleaned the board off enough as some of the tonner can off and sharpe didn't mark the gap. it still usable for testing drilling and soildering. I a step learning curve but in the end i will pay off.

this just popped up on my youtube recommended videos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0AHc3CA9NU

which, if you don't want to watch the video, points to:
https://makezine.com/2014/03/27/quickly-prototypes-circuits-with-new-inkjet-printable-conductive-ink/

looks good idea.

oh well after 3 attempts, finally got a good board made. was over the moon.
printed both sides and drilled(only broke 10 0.6 dril bits). only to find out i printed the circut board the worng way round lol i mirror the print with out needing to doh!

Darn! It is very easily done and very annoying.

I have also etched  and drilled a board which was accidentally 3/4 of full size so no components fitted!

That is probably why I ended up going to a "Board House" (Olimex in Bulgaria were good and cheap then) to have about 10 made up.

But that is no solution if you just want a one-off.

Which brings me back to cnc milling of boards. Sounds like a good idea. But having now viewed Tim S's video of the combined 3d printer/ miller I can now see THAT is not a great solution. (Problems with having to "beef-up" the mechanical components to cope with sideways loads and metal swarf (chips) wreaking havoc on electronics.

Why is nothing easy and why do I have so little bench space to house a cnc miller and a 3d printer, even if I could afford them both!?

David

Really pleased with the way it turned out. Only one mistake where one off the component where larger than I thought. Now to power it up and hope I don't get magic black smoke lol

very nice looking job...


still investigating the 3d milling aspect... and i came across the concept of "CNC engravers"

don't know if this will last longer than a 3d printer modified to mill...   but it is so cheap it might be worth a try...

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/CNC-1610-with-ER11-diy-cnc-engraving-machine-mini-Pcb-Milling-Machine-Wood-Carving-machine-cnc/32814106465.html?src=google&albslr=224624232&isdl=y&aff_short_key=UneMJZVf&source=%7Bifdyn:dyn%7D%7Bifpla:pla%7D%7Bifdbm:DBM&albch=DID%7D&src=google&albch=shopping&acnt=708-803-3821&isdl=y&albcp=653478879&albag=34653160498&slnk=&trgt=61865531738&plac=&crea=en32814106465&netw=g&device=c&mtctp=&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIiYKhyqWL2QIVCYzICh3PqwlSEAkYAiABEgIi-vD_BwE

same, for the price its worth a try. watched a lot of video on it and seams to work well.

might get on but saving up for a lathe first.

did have a panic attach when powering it up as only one part worked. messed up the code in the arduino lol.

So I have decided to put my toe in the water for 3D printers.

I have just placed an order for a Tronxy X1 from China for £115. (Small enough to fit on my desk and cheap enough to "bin" if it doesn't work out!)

I have also added 3D printers to the CAD/CAM section on the Forum. Let me know if you think that this area of growing importance needs even more emphasis.

David

good luck David. i would use fusion 360 to designs the parts. full autocad program and free for hobby use too

Just found this video to upgrade a 3d print.

Hi,
I might be a bt off subject or out of date, but I have just got my 458MHz radio working, but I used Eagle CAD for the PCB design & a chinese manufacturer. They take about 3 weeks, but I ordered 5 PCBs total was about £18, most of which was the cost for for the air freight. In fact they delivered 13 PCBs (minimum build I suppose).
Eagle CAD is not too bad to use, though I've used it before professionaly, but is free up to aboout 100m x 100m I think. Most of the pain is setting up new components, such as the RF module and the arduino module.

Did you use https://jlcpcb.com/ ?

Hi C3PO.

Yes now use them as not worth the effect milling them.

If you use Easyeda software, its a one click order which is handly.

Only thing is postage costs :(

Hi again,
I used https://www.elecrow.com/
They have advantage that they have a design rule file you can download to Eagle for a design rule check to make sure he design is compatible with their process (min/max tolerances, clearances etc.)
There are a lot of such companies though.