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    LA class semi kit.

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    david f
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  david f on Fri Jan 28, 2011 2:17 pm

    I look forward to that Geof and keep on asking questions in the meantime.
    (PVC tubes are still used by me, a certain well known editor is still addicted to wooden end caps and the good Red windscreen washer pumps are still available on eBay (Thanks to Andy for that tip.))

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Fri Jan 28, 2011 3:30 pm

    Hi Geoff(are you one 'f' or two?)

    Yes, if I were you I'd make the ballast tank from one length of 90mm tubing, it will be a lot easier in the long run, in fact now I've started on my LA I'm thinking of doing just that. The boat is quite heavy so it'll be needing more bouyancy than my wtc will provide, so a full length one will be better. Have a look at Paul Cook's article in MMI magazine on how he built his for his Revell Gato, that'll give you the basic idea.

    My ballast pump is indeed a 12 volt one (ex Halfords, around £15 with a metre or so of tubing), I searched high and low for an ex-VW Beetle pump as the early ones were fitted with 6 volt pumps, but never did find one, so I've had to settle for the 12 volt version. This will mean using a 12 volt battery and I'll have to invest in a BEC now (more expense!) but the pump will work a lot better.

    As to the in-tank pressure...I haven't a clue as yet. I may go down the vented tank road instead of the sealed tank, and just run a vent pipe up through the sail and into the bridge area.

    Mark (MMB) is making me a whole new deck (thanks mate, that's what I call good after service) so for now I'm just trying different things. Just made up the bearings for the rear planes to run in and glued them in position, then I can install the planes and rear cone.

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Fri Jan 28, 2011 4:08 pm

    This was my original plan of how to lay out the internals of the LA...ballast tank at battery and wtc balancing out the tank.






    NB : (= balance point)

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Sun Jan 30, 2011 7:53 pm

    Rear planes and tail cone fitted...(Mark will be thinking "that don't look right" about now...Not shown in the pic are the positioning brackets for the battery, ballast tank and the wtc, all made and installed.


    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Mon Jan 31, 2011 10:19 am

    In between working on the AMS website, I've done a bit more work on the LA...

    5mm thick styrene end stops added to keep the wtc/ballast tank/battery in place..


    WTC, ballast tank and battery in their respective places in the hull..


    And one slightly bigger pic..


    Today's jobs are to make and install the securing straps in the hull to prevent the wtc and the ballast tank from moving sideways, and to finish sanding the mould lines off of the bottom of the hull and drill the flood holes.
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    acrowot (Geof)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  acrowot (Geof) on Mon Jan 31, 2011 12:47 pm

    Hi Richard

    The LA is looking good such a clean lay out not like the old days when you had to fit it all in a box
    I do like the wtc you have made a nice job of it looks simple to set out.
    i can see why people go down that route .
    Mark from MMB making you a new deck is excellent customer Service which I feel lacks these days and good customer service should be praised.
    Going to try the water pump method in my fun sub cannot fit the compressor in
    I had a MFA fuel pump changed the motor to a speed 400 6volt and I will see how it goes in a sealed tank.
    Well my application form and cheque is in the post so hopefully I will be a member soon
    I have permission to go to Brockwell lido dive in on 27-march form the good lady so I am looking forward to that if the devil does not listen in
    Keep up the good work look forward to you progressing on

    All the best geof

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Mon Jan 31, 2011 1:10 pm

    Well, thank you for the kind comments Geoff, most gracious of you. Yes, I can't fault Mark on his service, both in the initial sale and the after sale...fingers are firmly crossed that the replacement deck will fit ok. He's left it in the mould to cure for an extra two days, so we'll see if that does the job.

    I'm still not 100% sure of using cylinders instead of boxes though, I was brought up on Darnell boxes. I have been dragged into the 21st century recently...electronic speed controllers instead of two microswitches and a servo, would you believe!

    I like the water pump ballast system, it's easy to set up and works very well, plus there's plenty of the stuff all around the boat, so it's easier to access than air when you're submerged!

    Good luck with your project mate, and welcome to the AMS!
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    nigele(ADMIN)2
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  nigele(ADMIN)2 on Mon Jan 31, 2011 1:38 pm

    Hi Geoff,

    re:MFA fuel pumps, they are unsuitable for water if you leave them standing the shaft rusts solid,the best pump is the good old blue or black pump,they will run on 6volt and are meant for water and are cheap.

    Pump HERE
    Or HERE







    (At Nigel's request, link changed...it now works.)

    Richard(ADMIN)[
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    acrowot (Geof)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  acrowot (Geof) on Mon Jan 31, 2011 4:42 pm

    Hi Richard

    Credit were due I believe
    Have I started something here got HMS resolution out of the loft may have ago at this one lot of work to be done plus I have a revel V11c 1/72 U-boat as well the wife bought me for Christmas ware do I start with that one?

    HI Nigele

    Thanks for the advice on the MFA pump did not know that
    I will open the links up at home can not access it from work many thanks

    As a new model submariner it would be great if we could make a list of items people use and were we can get them from in one place which I fell would help from making the same mistakes as I have over the years buying the wrong things as the items we using are not straight of the shelf from the local model shop.
    I personally have spent many hours helping people set up electric aircraft and were to get good motors speed controls lipos ect at a good price with what I know now the club has a lot of electric aircraft due to success first time around

    Many thanks again geof

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Mon Jan 31, 2011 5:19 pm

    A Resolution, eh? Which kit is it, Geoff?

    As for the Revell Type V11, you can buy a complete wtc with everything in it from "Big" Dave Welch in the US of A, but be warned...they ain't cheap!

    Dave's website is HERE
    Type V11c cylinder is HERE

    Front planes are easy enough to modify with a length of brass wire as are the rears.
    Prop shafts you can get made up from Mark@MMB, he'll make them to whatever size you need. Props from Cornwall Model Boats, I think they are 20mm?


    You can go mad and get etched brass decks for the Type V11c, very nice they are too, but again...not cheap.

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Mon Jan 31, 2011 5:22 pm

    As for the sub bits n' bobs list...take a look HERE I'll be adding more to the list over time, and as and when I get time!
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    acrowot (Geof)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  acrowot (Geof) on Wed Feb 02, 2011 1:00 am

    Hi Richard
    alls well now many thanks for the information on the revell v11c uboat when i have got some money together i will buy the WTC unit of dave welch.
    my HMS resolution was made 20 years ago but never got further than the bath tub kept leaking (i think i have now found a solution) it is scratch built from a 31/2 inch drain pipe stand of scale (from 50 feet) i had only a crud drawing at the time and the nose is wrong
    my building at the time was slower than it is now things kept changing from this idea to that idea drove me mad now i look at it my building skills were not great ether made a bannana tail cone on the back if you like i could start another thread on it were would be the best place?

    thanks nigele for the link for the washer pump i have got the black one on its way thanks for the advice

    i have posted some pictures in the archive section of sandown show

    how are you getting on with the LA?
    all the best geof

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Wed Feb 02, 2011 4:41 pm

    The hull is now just about fitted out with the various mountings for the wtc, ballast tank and the battery.


    The wtc sits on the three foam rubber strips to absorb any vibration, and to secure it in position I stretch rubber bands over it and hook them onto the little U shaped clips...they are epoxied into sections of old clothes peg, which in turn are soaked in epoxy resin to waterproof them. In front of the cylinder is a 1/4" thick styrene post which stops and fore and aft movement,and there will be another at the rear.


    To secure the ballast tank, I cut an 1" wide of acrylic tube(same size as the cylinder)and epoxied it into the hull bottom. The two tiny bulkheads stop any fore and aft movement, and again the ballast tank sits on two small sections of foam rubber strip.The stern bulkhead has a 1/2" diameter hole drilled through it to allow the silicone tubing to pass through on it's way to the pump in the wtc.


    To secure the battery I epoxied two redundant 380 motor mounts into the hull, and then epoxied two 3mm thick styrene strips onto the hull bottom to secure the battery in position.

    Everything is now secured firmly in place, and yet all can be removed in less than a minute. There are no signs of movement, even when the hull is tilted to almost 90 degrees vertically...just in case of a near vertical dive!.

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Thu Feb 03, 2011 2:24 pm

    Onwards and upwards...the hull fitting out is practically completed now, everything fits and surprisingly, everything lines up as it should. Just a little tidying up to do, power cables to secure in position, that sort of thing.

    Just waiting to get another esc to control the ballast pump, then I can complete the wiring harness.






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    acrowot (Geof)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  acrowot (Geof) on Fri Feb 04, 2011 3:02 pm

    Hi to you all

    The LA is taking shape really well the layout is so crisp and well thought out.
    I saw the LA on Ebay last night I think it was being sold by MMB the carriage was very reasonable
    Do you have to seal the terminals on the main battery to stop water getting to it as I think it makes life so much easier doing battery changes?
    How is your new deck is it on the way.
    Thanks for such a detailed summary I think this is a good way of showing new comers how to set things up.

    All the best Geof

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Fri Feb 04, 2011 3:57 pm

    Hi Geoff,

    Heard from Mark earlier today, the new deck is en route, may be here either tomorrow or Monday.

    Re the battery terminals...a good smear of Vaseline over them keeps corrosion at bay, and a good clean of the terminals every now and again prolongs battery life. It's so much easier with the main battery out in the free flood area, it does away with the need for an on/off switch...just pull a terminal off and the whole electronic circuit is dead. And there's a plus side as well...when going for a whole day's sailing (at a show, f'rinstance) you just take a spare (fully charged) battery with you, and when the first one shows signs of losing power, just swap them over ( a two minute job) and away you go again.

    Don't forget Geoff, if you buy an LA from Mark (MMB), call him and quote your AMS membership number, and you'll get a nice discount off the cost of the kit. Very useful, huh?...he's not a bad old boy really!

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Sat Feb 05, 2011 12:23 pm

    Interesting place to try and take a photo...

    Rear propshaft support bulkhead made from 3mm thick styrene with two PTFE bushes for the shaft to run in, and epoxied into place. The rear planes/rudder linkage rods will also run in PTFE tube, just making those up next.



    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Tue Feb 08, 2011 2:43 pm

    The new deck arrived yesterday, much better than the original one and half the weight. After a lot of filing, sanding and swearing I finally got it to fit, although I did manage to chip a lump out of the stern where it meets the cone, so a bit more filling and sanding to do there.

    Couldn't resist doing some work on the sail, and then when I'd done that I just had to sit the sail on the deck and take a photo...

    So far...it looks like a sub.


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    acrowot (Geof)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  acrowot (Geof) on Tue Feb 08, 2011 4:44 pm

    HI to you all
    Richard she’s looking very good the deck fits well and many thanks for the advice on the battery terminals this gives me a few options on my Hms Resolution

    I have gone submarine mad waiting for a submarine special, model submarine technology books and Rc submariner DVD.
    I have a lot to learn as my fun sub turned over when i tried to statically submerge in the bath (weight lower tank higher)ha ha all good fun.

    Nigele thanks again for the advice on the pump I have got one and it works a treat can not believe how much pressure it can build up on 7.2 volts.

    Keep up the good work on the LA looking forward to hearing how she goes Geof

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Tue Feb 08, 2011 8:00 pm

    Thanks Geoff!

    This is the front deck support bracket...a length of 4mm s/steel threaded rod, epoxied through the bottom of the hull then filed flush, filled and sanded smooth...up through a cross piece of 2mm styrene with two styrene brackets epoxied through to the bow section, with s/steel nuts and washers for added strength, and then a short section of styrene tube to cover the threaded rod, purely for aesthetic purposes.

    The deck then drops over the exposed piece of threaded rod and is secured(at the moment)by a nut, but I'm waiting for Our Magnificent Chairman to turn me up a threaded brass cone, which will represent the bow mounted sonar housing and secure the deck.

    "Vorsprung durch Technik....."


    mr t
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    build log

    Post  mr t on Thu Feb 10, 2011 7:31 pm

    rich, i must congratulate you on a fine build of your l.a. i hope my gato will look just as neat as your internals

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Thu Feb 10, 2011 7:39 pm

    Well, thank you kind sir...you wait until you see the outside!!
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    acrowot (Geof)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  acrowot (Geof) on Thu Feb 10, 2011 10:34 pm

    (wait till you see the outside) your teasing us now
    all the best geof

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: LA class semi kit.

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Fri Feb 11, 2011 10:53 am

    Well Geoff...you did ask!!

    This is the LA so far...I fancied a change from all the other boomers out there, so I did a spot of research and settled on this design for my boat. It's another Cold War Concept boat, known only as Project 575.










    The pics didn't come out too well, there's not really enough light in here at the minute, but they give you an idea of what it looks like.
    The fixing nut on the bows will be covered with a turned alloy cone which will represent the bow sonar housing, and there's still a fair bit more detailing to do on the sail...'scopes, masts, steps and rails, etc.

    mr t
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    build log

    Post  mr t on Fri Feb 11, 2011 4:25 pm

    richard or shall we call you the experement maker?

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    Re: LA class semi kit.

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