The Association of Model Submariners.

Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

* THE FORUM FOR ALL THOSE INTERESTED IN BUILDING AND OPERATING MODEL SUBMARINES *



Join the AMS - Registered Forum users can become members of the AMS and it's free ...... To join send an email with your name , address and phone number to amstreasure@googlemail.com


For a guide to past events see the "Shows and Events" section.

Papplewick Pumping Station, Nottingham, April 9th & 10th


,

"***"

Who is online?

In total there are 4 users online :: 0 Registered, 0 Hidden and 4 Guests

None


Most users ever online was 180 on Tue Nov 05, 2019 6:03 am

Latest topics

» 27Mhz - Radio Ideas
Ballast bag EmptyToday at 10:45 am by david f

» Type II U-boat
Ballast bag EmptyWed Mar 22, 2023 3:05 am by tsenecal

» WW2 mini sub build
Ballast bag EmptyTue Mar 21, 2023 9:21 pm by tsenecal

» Not the hobby I expected :)
Ballast bag EmptyTue Mar 21, 2023 8:03 pm by SimonH

» Papplewick Pumping Station 2023 - 9th & 10th April
Ballast bag EmptyTue Mar 21, 2023 10:09 am by david f

» 915mhz / 868mhz as a viable frequency for submarines.
Ballast bag EmptyMon Mar 20, 2023 1:41 pm by david f

» Frsky - 915Mhz equipment
Ballast bag EmptyMon Mar 20, 2023 1:40 pm by david f

» TBS Crossfire - 915Mhz equipment
Ballast bag EmptyMon Mar 20, 2023 1:38 pm by david f

» ExpressLRS - 915Mhz equipment
Ballast bag EmptyMon Mar 20, 2023 1:35 pm by david f

Statistics

Our users have posted a total of 11876 messages in 1942 subjects

We have 973 registered users

The newest registered user is skyray

2 posters

    Ballast bag

    avatar
    Nacken
    Guest


    Posts : 5
    Join date : 2011-10-10

    Ballast bag Empty Ballast bag

    Post  Nacken Mon Oct 10, 2011 10:06 pm

    just a quickie if I fit a water ballast bag inside my wtc will it empty with just the pressure build up in the wtc or will the water need to be pumped out?
    Hermann
    Hermann
    AMS member


    Posts : 118
    Join date : 2011-07-03
    Location : at home, near Bremen (Germany)

    Ballast bag Empty Re: Ballast bag

    Post  Hermann Tue Oct 11, 2011 6:49 pm

    Hello,

    that's just a question of the pressures inside and outside the WTC and depends also on the relationship between the total inner volume of your WTC and the volume of your ballast bag.

    Imagine you are at the surface. Then you have to pump water into your ballast bag to overcome the increasing inner air pressure of the residual WTC volume and you must shut a ballast valve to keep the water in your ballst bag as long you are close to the surface and water pressure is lower than the inner air pressure of the WTC. Otherwise the ballast water will be pressed out and the model will surface.
    But with increasing diving depth the water pressure rises and in a certain depth it will be higher than the inner air pressure so when opening the valve even more water will enter the bag and surfacing is impossible. That certain depth where the water pressure equals the inner pressure depends upon the volume ratio of the WTC volume and the bag volume. If the WTC volume is relativly large compared to the bag volume the inner pressure will rise only for a small percentage of the normal atmospheric pressure, so the critical limit is already reached in a small depth (rough exaple: ratio WTC:bag = 10:1 will raise the inner pressure approx. by 10 percent. A water pressure of 10 percent more than normal atmospheric pressure that equals will be reached in a depth of about 1 metre (or 3 ft) that is not much.)
    Large ratios resulting in greater depths are feasible but that method is not recommended in general. You should always provide a pump that is also able to get the water out against a higher water pressure (at least half an atmosphere) to bring your model home.

    By the way - perhaps you have already experienced a model with a pressure hull or WTC that is not really tight. When pumping water in bubbles will come out due to the increasing inner pressure. When the model submerges you will see that the bubbles will become less and from a certain depth on there will be no more bubbles coming out (than the water pressure is higher than the inner pressure). When lifting the model bubbles will start again.

    Kind regards
    Hermann


    Last edited by Hermann on Tue Oct 11, 2011 6:53 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : additional text)
    avatar
    Nacken
    Guest


    Posts : 5
    Join date : 2011-10-10

    Ballast bag Empty Re: Ballast bag

    Post  Nacken Wed Oct 12, 2011 7:03 am

    Thank you Hermman for your concise reply I can now say that I fully understand and will have to rethink my ballast plumbing
    thank you

      Current date/time is Wed Mar 29, 2023 6:02 pm