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* THE FORUM FOR ALL THOSE INTERESTED IN BUILDING AND OPERATING MODEL SUBMARINES *



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*2021 AND SOME EVENTS ARE BEING PROPOSED. Keep them coming and let us know the details!

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(CANCELLED in 2020) Submarine, Boating & Sailing Weekend, Norwich MBC, Weekend of 25,26th July

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Bournville Sub Day. Sept 2021 is looking likely. More details TBA.

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Barrow in Furness Regatta and Sub day. Maybe in Sept 2021. Details TBA.

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Latest topics

» Going Brushless?
PCB Desgins EmptySun May 09, 2021 2:16 am by tsenecal

» google sub view
PCB Desgins EmptyFri May 07, 2021 7:07 pm by SimonH

» UHF radio control for submarines (openLRS, LoRa, FSK etc. on 458Mhz and 433Mhz )
PCB Desgins EmptyTue May 04, 2021 4:54 pm by C-3PO

» PCB Desgins
PCB Desgins EmptySun May 02, 2021 11:53 am by SimonH

» Thanks for the link
PCB Desgins EmptyThu Apr 29, 2021 8:20 pm by Michaelc

» Speed controller wiring
PCB Desgins EmptyThu Apr 29, 2021 6:33 pm by salmon

» Thunder tiger submarine
PCB Desgins EmptyThu Apr 29, 2021 6:32 pm by Michaelc

» Sheerline Type 7 wanted
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» New chap to the forum
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    PCB Desgins

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    timgarrod
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    Post  timgarrod Wed Jan 17, 2018 10:09 pm

    Hi All,

    Been a busy couple of months and learning alot (head hurts) arduino/cad and now PCB Designing.

    Brought a 3d printer and loving it. Found you can convert it to be a cnc mill and plotter so thought i would give a go at printing my own boards as mine stripboard as not nice to see lol.

    its only a basic layout but thought i give it a go. Off to maplin on the weekend to buy the fluid and boards.

    PCB Desgins Pcb210
    PCB Desgins Pcb_to10
    PCB Desgins Pcb_un10

    Hopefully this will help in future builds.

    please let me know if i draw then wrong if it there's a better way to do them.

    cheers
    tim
    david f
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    Post  david f Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:02 am

    Hi Tim.
    That looks really good!

    I didn't know that 3D printers could also do this. How is it done??

    I have made PCBs by the etch method and it is rather laborious and messy for one-off boards. This method looks to have a lot of potential for us.

    I don't know what software you are using for the design? (I used Eagle some years back.)

    You have made the board quite spacious which can be good for we amateurs. ( Don't forget to make the copper lands bigger if they are carrying much current.)

    David
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    Post  timgarrod Thu Jan 18, 2018 6:55 pm

    Thanks David, still getting my head round it so hopfully make it smaller.

    I got the idea from the videos on youtube and a perminment marker.


    Been using Fritizing and design spark to make them. with this it makes the 3d more usefull. will see how it comes out on the weekend.

    Cheers
    salmon
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    Post  salmon Sun Jan 21, 2018 5:15 pm

    This is interesting! I will be looking forward to your updates.


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    Post  david f Thu Jan 25, 2018 3:32 pm

    I see!

    I suppose I was hoping to avoid an etching step but you would need a CNC mill to do that?

    Which raises the question (looking at my limited bench space) can you get 3D printers which also have a milling attachment? Nice to have the ability to "giveth AND taketh away".

    I see that the video shows an etch resistant pen. I wonder if you could deposit a thin layer of plastic on the copper? Could avoid problems of the etchant getting under the resist and could provide a dimple for the drilling operation. (I seem to remember breaking quite a few drills!)

    Very interesting!

    David


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    Post  timgarrod Thu Jan 25, 2018 6:53 pm

    Hi David,

    quick answer i yes. there also dremel designs you can print off.

    Having a issue with the printing at the moment as the pen hold is so far away from the print head it keep drawing off the table.

    will not let this beat me :)

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    Post  tsenecal Tue Jan 30, 2018 4:54 pm

    david f wrote:I see!

    I suppose I was hoping to avoid an etching step but you would need a CNC mill to do that?

    Which raises the question (looking at my limited bench space) can you get 3D printers which also have a milling attachment? Nice to have the ability to "giveth AND taketh away".

    I see that the video shows an etch resistant pen. I wonder if you could deposit a thin layer of plastic on the copper? Could avoid problems of the etchant getting under the resist and could provide a dimple for the drilling operation. (I seem to remember breaking quite a few drills!)

    Very interesting!

    David



    i too was curious if it was possible... i find that this guy seems to know what he is doing when it comes to 3d printers... so i would pattern my conversion after his...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDz1A1XDOt8&t=134s
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    Post  timgarrod Tue Jan 30, 2018 5:40 pm

    totally agree. I think the idea will work out for the 3d printer but thinking dont what to damage it by putting extra stress from milling. I like th idea of the t8 cnc mills. about the same price as the 3d printer and built to do the job

    So gone back to basics and use tonner and iron. printed two board now, first one came out really well but i made the signal track too thin and rubbed off. the 2nd one was alot better but i don't think i cleaned the board off enough as some of the tonner can off and sharpe didn't mark the gap. it still usable for testing drilling and soildering. I a step learning curve but in the end i will pay off.
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    Post  tsenecal Thu Feb 01, 2018 4:57 pm

    this just popped up on my youtube recommended videos:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0AHc3CA9NU

    which, if you don't want to watch the video, points to:
    https://makezine.com/2014/03/27/quickly-prototypes-circuits-with-new-inkjet-printable-conductive-ink/
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    Post  timgarrod Fri Feb 02, 2018 7:01 pm

    looks good idea.

    oh well after 3 attempts, finally got a good board made. was over the moon.
    printed both sides and drilled(only broke 10 0.6 dril bits). only to find out i printed the circut board the worng way round lol i mirror the print with out needing to doh!
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    Post  david f Sat Feb 03, 2018 9:26 am

    Darn! It is very easily done and very annoying.

    I have also etched  and drilled a board which was accidentally 3/4 of full size so no components fitted!

    That is probably why I ended up going to a "Board House" (Olimex in Bulgaria were good and cheap then) to have about 10 made up.

    But that is no solution if you just want a one-off.

    Which brings me back to cnc milling of boards. Sounds like a good idea. But having now viewed Tim S's video of the combined 3d printer/ miller I can now see THAT is not a great solution. (Problems with having to "beef-up" the mechanical components to cope with sideways loads and metal swarf (chips) wreaking havoc on electronics.

    Why is nothing easy and why do I have so little bench space to house a cnc miller and a 3d printer, even if I could afford them both!?

    David
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    Post  timgarrod Sat Feb 03, 2018 8:06 pm

    Really pleased with the way it turned out. Only one mistake where one off the component where larger than I thought. Now to power it up and hope I don't get magic black smoke lol

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    Post  tsenecal Sun Feb 04, 2018 3:16 am

    very nice looking job...


    still investigating the 3d milling aspect... and i came across the concept of "CNC engravers"

    don't know if this will last longer than a 3d printer modified to mill...   but it is so cheap it might be worth a try...

    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/CNC-1610-with-ER11-diy-cnc-engraving-machine-mini-Pcb-Milling-Machine-Wood-Carving-machine-cnc/32814106465.html?src=google&albslr=224624232&isdl=y&aff_short_key=UneMJZVf&source=%7Bifdyn:dyn%7D%7Bifpla:pla%7D%7Bifdbm:DBM&albch=DID%7D&src=google&albch=shopping&acnt=708-803-3821&isdl=y&albcp=653478879&albag=34653160498&slnk=&trgt=61865531738&plac=&crea=en32814106465&netw=g&device=c&mtctp=&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIiYKhyqWL2QIVCYzICh3PqwlSEAkYAiABEgIi-vD_BwE
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    Post  timgarrod Sun Feb 04, 2018 10:51 am

    same, for the price its worth a try. watched a lot of video on it and seams to work well.

    might get on but saving up for a lathe first.

    did have a panic attach when powering it up as only one part worked. messed up the code in the arduino lol.

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    Post  david f Thu Feb 08, 2018 9:02 am

    So I have decided to put my toe in the water for 3D printers.

    I have just placed an order for a Tronxy X1 from China for £115. (Small enough to fit on my desk and cheap enough to "bin" if it doesn't work out!)

    I have also added 3D printers to the CAD/CAM section on the Forum. Let me know if you think that this area of growing importance needs even more emphasis.

    David
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    Post  timgarrod Thu Feb 08, 2018 6:47 pm

    good luck David. i would use fusion 360 to designs the parts. full autocad program and free for hobby use too
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    Post  timgarrod Tue Jun 26, 2018 10:10 pm

    Just found this video to upgrade a 3d print.
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    Post  SimonH Sat May 01, 2021 9:05 pm

    Hi,
    I might be a bt off subject or out of date, but I have just got my 458MHz radio working, but I used Eagle CAD for the PCB design & a chinese manufacturer. They take about 3 weeks, but I ordered 5 PCBs total was about £18, most of which was the cost for for the air freight. In fact they delivered 13 PCBs (minimum build I suppose).
    Eagle CAD is not too bad to use, though I've used it before professionaly, but is free up to aboout 100m x 100m I think. Most of the pain is setting up new components, such as the RF module and the arduino module.
    C-3PO
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    Post  C-3PO Sun May 02, 2021 8:00 am

    Did you use https://jlcpcb.com/ ?

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    Post  timgarrod Sun May 02, 2021 9:36 am

    Hi C3PO.

    Yes now use them as not worth the effect milling them.

    If you use Easyeda software, its a one click order which is handly.

    Only thing is postage costs :(
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    Post  SimonH Sun May 02, 2021 11:53 am

    Hi again,
    I used https://www.elecrow.com/
    They have advantage that they have a design rule file you can download to Eagle for a design rule check to make sure he design is compatible with their process (min/max tolerances, clearances etc.)
    There are a lot of such companies though.

      Current date/time is Tue May 18, 2021 2:59 am