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    newbie help!

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    richard712
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    newbie help!

    Post  richard712 on Fri May 04, 2012 8:02 pm

    Hi everyone.Im new to this site and to sub water activities!Ive been building rc boats for a number of years and have finally decided to take the plunge into submarines.Firstly it seems very expensive (more so than helicopters which i didnt think possible!)and second very complex.Ive been looking at a Robbe u47 but would prefer the static diving system but all the info i can find are self made adaptations using parts from Engel and a lot of adaptation.Is there anyone out there who could offer some advice to a newcomer like me on wether i could build the aforementioned adapted u-boat or wether i am better off starting with a dynamic diver and adapting it in a year or so?The last thing i want to do is spend a fortune on all the kit get frustrated and give up but at the same time dont want to waste £400+ and a year later have to start from scratch! Im a competent modeller and happy working with wood plastic and metal.Any help and advice would be greatly appreciated!!!

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Fri May 04, 2012 8:51 pm

    Hi Richard, and welcome to the AMS forum,

    I will say in answer to your query that model subs don't need to be complex or expensive...if they were either, then I wouldn't be doing this. I'm on a strict budget and a small pension nowadays, and have to work out of my bedroom, so complex and expensive are out on both counts for me!

    I've never built a Robbe U47, but there are one or two members on here who have, so I'll let them advise you on your questions.

    In the meantime all I can do is to wish you well with your project.



    Richard(ADMIN)
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    david f
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  david f on Sat May 05, 2012 11:56 am

    Do also have a look also at Sheerline (either new or secondhand.)

    I have never built one but I like the construction method and design concept. They work and they are even made in Britain!

    David

    richard712
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  richard712 on Sun May 06, 2012 10:57 am

    Many thanks

    Ill have a look at Sheerline.Have also been looking on Engels website and seems like it would be easier to buy a complete package from them rather than trying to adapt the Robbe.Ive also noticed that Engels prices are half of what Westborne models are charging for exactly the same thing,minus cost of posting.

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Sun May 06, 2012 1:38 pm

    The Engel boats are superb Richard, you'll not go far wrong with one of those...but:

    If you choose a Sheerline kit, you'll enjoy a lot more advantages.

    It's made here in the UK..
    Chris is only a phone call away should you need advice on anything..
    A Sheerline kit goes together first time, every time..
    Everything is in the box with a Sheerline kit (apart from the radio, of course)
    Chris a bloody nice bloke.

    (I should say here that neither I or the AMS have nothing to do with Chris or Sheerline Model Submarines on a commercial basis..it's just that Sheerline make a good sub kit)

    richard712
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  richard712 on Sun May 06, 2012 4:06 pm

    Now youve got me thinking! Im off to Sheerlines website for another look.Ive just finished watching 20,000 leagues under the sea and how id love the Nautilous!!!! I think ill start with something a bit less complex !Thanks for all your advice.Im sure ill be pestering you again soon!

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Sun May 06, 2012 5:43 pm

    Feel free to pester!

    richard712
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  richard712 on Sun May 06, 2012 8:01 pm

    You will live to regret saying that! Has anyone got any opinions on recomended radio gear? Ive used spektrums 2.4GHZ on my last heli but this is totally different and noticed on a few pics online the Robbe/Futaba system seems popular?

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Sun May 06, 2012 8:24 pm

    Firstly, you'll not be able to use 2.4gHz radio in a sub, but I guess you'll know that.

    I use a Robbe F-14 transmitter with either Robbe rx's or the Corona rx which I get from HobbyKing, about a tenner for a nine channel rx and you don't need crystals either.

    Multiplex are also very good if you need a multitude of channels, and for a real good 6 channel outfit, tale a look at the HiTec Optic 6. I had one for ages, then sold it to finance the F-14...as you do.
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    Giovanni LiCalsi
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  Giovanni LiCalsi on Mon May 07, 2012 1:23 am

    I have a Robbe F-14, too. Great radio but don't overlook the other radios on the used market.
    The Graupner MC-19 computerized radio transmitter is excellent as well and a 2.4GHz transmitter can be installed and used in combination with the standard transmitter by using a three-way toggle switch. Since the computer screen has marine, surface and aircraft , you can have the best of both worlds. These radios are getting very inexpensive on the second hand market, as well.
    Also, the Graupner Type VII submarine is stunning!
    It comes fully assembled, except for the piston ballast tanks or whatever ballast system you may choose.
    Happy hunting!

    http://www.v-eastonline.com/products/WP-U%252dBOOT-TYPE-VII-.html

    richard712
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  richard712 on Mon May 07, 2012 10:16 am

    I wasnt aware i couldnt use 2.4GHZ in a sub but thats great to know,cuts the outlay down a bit!Ill do a bit of research on the F-14 transmitter today.The reciever sounds a bargain at a tenner though.

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Mon May 07, 2012 11:17 am

    richard712 wrote:I wasnt aware i couldnt use 2.4GHZ in a sub but thats great to know,cuts the outlay down a bit!Ill do a bit of research on the F-14 transmitter today.The reciever sounds a bargain at a tenner though.


    Richard...you cannot, repeat cannot use 2.4ghz in a sub, the signal just will not penetrate the water to allow you to submerge. Extensive tests have been carried out on this, trust me...

    27mHz or 40mHz is the way you need to go. I used one of the old Futaba M series for years without a problem or a glitch, I'd be more than happy with another one even now. Go Robbe/Futaba 40mHz F series...you'll not regret it.


    Richard(ADMIN)

    richard712
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  richard712 on Mon May 07, 2012 3:17 pm

    Right.Ive been looking at the Robbe F14 and the more i look at it the more confused im getting!It seems a very modular system that you can add to as when required but from what i can work out i need 5 channels? 1 for forward planes,1 for aft,1 rudder,1 speed control for twin motors and 1 for ballast pump (ballraced servo from what ive read).Also,on Sheerlines website it says about an auto leveller which the only one i can find is by Subtech in the states.I take it this works in a similar manner to a gyro on a helicopter but turned 90 degrees controlling vertical rather than horizontal movement? Does this need a separate channel or,like a heli goes in between the reciever and the rear planes? Sorry bout all these questions! Want to get everything straight in my mind and have a reasonable understanding of it all before i start.Can anyone recommend any reading matter i could buy for reference? Many many thanks everyone!

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Mon May 07, 2012 3:59 pm



    You're correct, all of the Robbe F-series are expandable to some degree, some more than others...my F-14 has...hang on...running out of fingers here...8 channels, I believe some of the later ones can go on up to a dozen or more, far to much for me to cope with!

    For basic control you'll need (assuming we're talking a Sheerline here) (a)ahead/astern, (b)left/right rudder, (c) ballast tank fill/empty, and (d) rear planes. Have an auto leveller hooked in here, and don't worry about front planes, they don't really do a lot in model form. A good leveller you can get from Mike Stothers at Microgyros (www.microgyros.com) they are good and reasonably priced. Get the esc from him at the same time...very good design, small and bullet proof. A leveller does what it says on the tin...it will pick up small differences in the angle that your boat is running at and send a signal to the servo to correct itself. Microgyros levellers can be overidden on the tx, so if you are running on the surface and you need to crash dive, just whack the tx stick to 'dive' and the planes will do as you wish. Same if you running submerged and need to perform an emergency surface.

    Phew...does that help?

    richard712
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  richard712 on Mon May 07, 2012 4:18 pm

    FANTASTIC!!! A few things have soaked into the grey matter! Thank you very much,its becoming clearer in my mind now,a few days ago it seemed impossible!

    Tom(ADMIN)
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Mon May 07, 2012 4:40 pm

    After thirty odd years it still seems impossible!

    richard712
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  richard712 on Fri May 11, 2012 5:41 pm

    Hi everyone,im afraid im back to bug you again!! Got a copy of Engels catalogue yesterday and after a lot of thought i think im going to go for the Nautilus.One thing i dont understand is looking at pics on the net the entire bottom hull makes up the WTC rather than a tube inside the hull.How does water get to and from the ballast tanks is there 2 thru hull fittings as i cant see any!
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    Giovanni LiCalsi
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  Giovanni LiCalsi on Fri May 11, 2012 6:12 pm

    I'm not sure how their ballast tank works, but you can use a water tight compartment tube.
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    salmon
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    Re: newbie help!

    Post  salmon on Fri May 11, 2012 8:24 pm

    From looking at the site, the Nautilus uses their piston tanks, so I would say yes there is an opening for the tanks to intake water. Sweet looking submarine!


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