* THE FORUM FOR ALL THOSE INTERESTED IN BUILDING AND OPERATING MODEL SUBMARINES *



Join the AMS - Registered Forum users can become members of the AMS and it's free ...... To join register on the forum first then follow the forum link to our membership form which is on our website


For further details of any events shown here also see the "Shows and Events" section on the forum

Let us know of your plans for 2017 and we will promote them on this Forum

.

.

,.

. .

.

.

Bournville MBC, West Midlands, 17th Sept

Edinburgh MBC Warship & Sub Day, 24th Sept

Who is online?

In total there are 5 users online :: 0 Registered, 0 Hidden and 5 Guests :: 1 Bot

None


Most users ever online was 37 on Sun Mar 13, 2011 11:27 am

Latest topics

» Bournville Sep 2017
Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:28 pm by timgarrod

» Model Sub Related Events for 2017
Fri Sep 08, 2017 9:00 am by david f

» Haydock Park 2017
Wed Sep 06, 2017 12:08 pm by david f

» Going Brushless?
Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:55 pm by david f

» Barrow in Furness MBC regatta and sub day
Mon Sep 04, 2017 3:46 pm by david f

» Model Boat Convention, Haydock Park, 26,27 August
Mon Aug 14, 2017 9:27 am by david f

» Frequency checker
Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:17 pm by hooper

» IJN Type KD3 fleet submarine or similar
Sat Aug 05, 2017 8:13 pm by offroad

» Norwich Model Sub Weekend 2017 - Norwich MBC
Sat Aug 05, 2017 9:33 am by david f

Statistics

Our users have posted a total of 10329 messages in 1673 subjects

We have 734 registered users

The newest registered user is LenaMax24


    Pumps (geared variety)

    Share
    avatar
    Resolution Rog
    Guest

    Posts : 34
    Join date : 2010-11-08

    Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  Resolution Rog on Sun Feb 27, 2011 9:33 pm

    I have one of the original geared 'Orange' pumps, which on a bench test involving sucking water out of a tin and into a drink water bottle leaked water everywhere.
    The bottle had a 1mm hole so the pressure build up was minimal, and on taking the pump apart water had passed through into the motor. Don't think the p/p was new when I was given same. David, there is a picture of yours on the facebook site showing a replacement 'orange' pump, do you have a contact for this, and how has it performed over time? I'm happy to purchase a windscreen p/p via e-bay, but as I require it to pump each way, I am uncertain how you tell from the picture which are one way impellor p/ps and which are bi-directional gear p/ps. Any advice would be well received.
    Roger

    Tom(ADMIN)
    AMS Forum Owner

    Posts : 2989
    Join date : 2010-11-05
    Age : 57
    Location : Nevada, USA

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Sun Feb 27, 2011 9:40 pm

    Roger, both of the pumps I have for Project 575 are from Halfords, just common or garden screenwash pumps, and both pump either way quite happily.
    avatar
    Resolution Rog
    Guest

    Posts : 34
    Join date : 2010-11-08

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  Resolution Rog on Sun Feb 27, 2011 11:05 pm

    thanks Richard, I'll have a look in Halfords. Any clues to make etc. or price will give me an idea which pump you have.Roger
    avatar
    acrowot (Geof)
    Guest

    Posts : 158
    Join date : 2011-01-21
    Age : 46
    Location : chessington surrey

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  acrowot (Geof) on Sun Feb 27, 2011 11:38 pm

    Hi Roger
    i was looking for a geared pump for a ballast tank and was kindly directed by nigele to a couple i have left below the message and links to a black one which i bought works very well one thng i have found is if you close of the inlet pipe when ballast tank has compressed the air in the sealed tank the pump leaks a little could easley seal the front plate on better and the pump pumps in and out no problem it does look identical to the halfords one and is a lot cheeper
    and the second link is an orange one may be the one you are looking for i would like to say i am new to model submarines so i may not be qualified to comment in some areas
    many thanks geof
    re:MFA fuel pumps, they are unsuitable for water if you leave them standing the shaft rusts solid,the best pump is the good old blue or black pump,they will run on 6volt and are meant for water and are cheap.

    Pump HERE
    Or HERE
    avatar
    nigele(ADMIN)2
    AMS Chairman

    Posts : 1103
    Join date : 2010-11-06
    Age : 63
    Location : Braintree, Essex

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  nigele(ADMIN)2 on Sun Feb 27, 2011 11:54 pm

    Roger,the orange pump is the one you want,I have just bought two and run them under presure until they stall,no leaks.
    avatar
    Resolution Rog
    Guest

    Posts : 34
    Join date : 2010-11-08

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  Resolution Rog on Mon Feb 28, 2011 9:04 am

    Thanks to all who replied, have just e-bayed a red pump.
    Nigele, I notice from a picture of your 'x'craft that there are a couple of green relays behind the pump. Are these for pump control and if so do you have details, circuits etc? Also do people have a preference to these, rather than servo and micro switches?
    many thanks
    Roger
    avatar
    david f
    AMS Treasurer

    Posts : 1888
    Join date : 2010-11-10
    Age : 67
    Location : Cumbria

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  david f on Mon Feb 28, 2011 2:10 pm

    Yes Rog, the ebay red pump is the one, as per Nigel's comments.

    The one I bought last October has been used many times in my Charlie sub and is still going strong.
    avatar
    david f
    AMS Treasurer

    Posts : 1888
    Join date : 2010-11-10
    Age : 67
    Location : Cumbria

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  david f on Wed Jun 01, 2011 8:37 am



    Well the ebay "Red" pump has just stopped pumping(the motor still runs. On dismantling the problem is that the gear pump shaft is no longer fixed to the gear (See above.)

    There were remnants of some sort of glue.

    Would I still recommend them?

    Yes, it has had comsiderable use since October in my Charlie and UuPVC class. As you will see from the photo the standard of construction is pretty good. The pump also failed safe i.e I could not dive.

    I may try fixing the shaft with (Epoxy, Loctite Red ??) but will not use this particular pump in another sub.

    Tom(ADMIN)
    AMS Forum Owner

    Posts : 2989
    Join date : 2010-11-05
    Age : 57
    Location : Nevada, USA

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Wed Jun 01, 2011 8:41 am

    Would it be possible to sleeve the shaft with a sliver of alloy tube, maybe...then re-attach everything with a drop of superglue?
    avatar
    david f
    AMS Treasurer

    Posts : 1888
    Join date : 2010-11-10
    Age : 67
    Location : Cumbria

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  david f on Wed Jun 01, 2011 8:47 am

    Maybe, Richard.

    You can see that there is a flat on the metal shaft which should help any glue type fix.

    I think I will try the Loctite Red approach(That stuff really locks shafts on) but there is no rush because I had a spare pump which is now fitted ready for Alfold.

    Tom(ADMIN)
    AMS Forum Owner

    Posts : 2989
    Join date : 2010-11-05
    Age : 57
    Location : Nevada, USA

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Wed Jun 01, 2011 8:50 am

    Sorry, I was looking at the wrong shaft...it's worth a try to salvage the pump, they are always useful for testing purposes.

    Glad you're operational again for Alfold though...look forward to meeting you.
    avatar
    david f
    AMS Treasurer

    Posts : 1888
    Join date : 2010-11-10
    Age : 67
    Location : Cumbria

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  david f on Fri Jun 10, 2011 2:42 pm

    I am still a bit puzzled by the pump failure.

    If you look carefully at the photo, the motor shaft has a flat but there is no flat on the gear rotor.

    I've just had a look at a new pump and, of course,there is a flat on the shaft and the gear rotor.

    I think something may have got stuck in this pump, damaging the plastic rotor.
    Maybe the bit of "epoxy" I saw was actually some rubbish that damaged the pump.

    I think these pumps (which are rather important to a lot of us) are probably fine. I've just fitted a replacement and time will tell.

    (I tried a Loctite Red fix to the damaged pump - no good. Not to worry - spares box!)
    avatar
    david f
    AMS Treasurer

    Posts : 1888
    Join date : 2010-11-10
    Age : 67
    Location : Cumbria

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  david f on Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:13 am

    Had to find a new supplier for these pumps on ebay (The original supplier was only supplying the black 24 volt ones) but these look like the right ones:

    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BN-Universal-12V-Lucas-Type-Windscreen-Washer-Pump-/360390328712?_trksid=p4340.m263&_trkparms=algo%3DDLSL%252BSIC%26its%3DI%26itu%3DUCI%252BIA%252BUA%252BIEW%252BFICS%252BUFI%252BDDSIC%26otn%3D8%26pmod%3D250735261541%252B250735261541%26po%3D%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D2513906338043357330



    Last edited by david f on Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:42 am; edited 1 time in total

    Tom(ADMIN)
    AMS Forum Owner

    Posts : 2989
    Join date : 2010-11-05
    Age : 57
    Location : Nevada, USA

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:36 am

    12 volt black ones are still available in Halfords, David...


    PUMPS
    avatar
    david f
    AMS Treasurer

    Posts : 1888
    Join date : 2010-11-10
    Age : 67
    Location : Cumbria

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  david f on Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:53 am

    Yes, but call me conservative. I (and Nigel!) only trust the red ones.
    (Sounds like a superstition in the making like not wearing green and whistling on a fishing boat!)
    avatar
    Hermann
    AMS member

    Posts : 105
    Join date : 2011-07-03
    Location : at home, near Bremen (Germany)

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  Hermann on Sun Sep 04, 2011 8:29 pm

    david f wrote:

    ...I may try fixing the shaft with (Epoxy, Loctite Red ??)...


    Hello David,

    what about a quite different approach for repairing the pump? You might recreate a flattened area in the hole by the use of a small strip of sheet metal (as sketched in the picture below). Of course you have to be very skilled when making the small cuts with the jigsaw. But I think this repaired rotor will not wear down so quickly.



    Best regards
    Hermann

    p.s. Due to my experience glue is probably problematic to fix the rotor because the glue may chip off of may get loose when exposed to water for longer times. Super glue is not really waterproof for longer times.


    Last edited by Hermann on Sun Sep 04, 2011 8:33 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : adding some remarks concerning glue)
    avatar
    david f
    AMS Treasurer

    Posts : 1888
    Join date : 2010-11-10
    Age : 67
    Location : Cumbria

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  david f on Mon Sep 05, 2011 8:30 am

    Thanks Hermann. That looks like a good repair method.

    But I'm afraid that when it comes to things that are needed to get your boat to come back to the surface - I get all "conservative" again!

    So I don't repair but replace the pump. (Hence my desparate search on Ebay!)

    David

    PS Sorry I haven't written in a while and it looks like the coach trip to the Dortmund show will be "on " next year.
    avatar
    Giovanni LiCalsi
    Guest

    Posts : 170
    Join date : 2010-11-15
    Age : 67
    Location : Alameda, California, USA

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  Giovanni LiCalsi on Wed Sep 07, 2011 3:35 am

    Volvo made some very good pumps, too.
    Giovanni

    1975-1993 Volvo windshield washer pump
    avatar
    david f
    AMS Treasurer

    Posts : 1888
    Join date : 2010-11-10
    Age : 67
    Location : Cumbria

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  david f on Wed Sep 07, 2011 10:02 am

    Yes, thanks for the information.

    The red pumpp arrived today from the ebay supplier I quoted earlier and they look fine. About £7 each including postage.
    avatar
    david f
    AMS Treasurer

    Posts : 1888
    Join date : 2010-11-10
    Age : 67
    Location : Cumbria

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  david f on Sat Oct 22, 2011 6:09 pm

    These red pumps are not what they once were!(I believe they are now made in China)

    I was testing ORP Dzik ready for the pond tomorrow. Pump was pumping and then suddenly made a much smoother, high pitched tone and stopped pumping.

    Taking it to bits showed that it had failed in the same way as the last one. (The gear rotor starts to slip on the "flatted" motor shaft.

    If there is a plus side - I am getting quite quick at replacing them and they do fail safe!

    David
    avatar
    david f
    AMS Treasurer

    Posts : 1888
    Join date : 2010-11-10
    Age : 67
    Location : Cumbria

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  david f on Sat Oct 22, 2011 6:14 pm

    Just looking through this thread, I have had to replace 2 so far and they lasted for 9 months and then 5 months.

    They used to last 2 or 3 years.

    Tom(ADMIN)
    AMS Forum Owner

    Posts : 2989
    Join date : 2010-11-05
    Age : 57
    Location : Nevada, USA

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Sat Oct 22, 2011 6:56 pm

    Lack of quality control...or lack of quality.
    avatar
    david f
    AMS Treasurer

    Posts : 1888
    Join date : 2010-11-10
    Age : 67
    Location : Cumbria

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  david f on Sun Oct 23, 2011 2:07 pm

    I think that the plastic they are using is much softer.

    A pity - I will use up my stock and look for replacements or accelerate my piston tank programme!

    (The replacement pump worked well at Barrow this morning but in 5 months time!!?)

    Tom(ADMIN)
    AMS Forum Owner

    Posts : 2989
    Join date : 2010-11-05
    Age : 57
    Location : Nevada, USA

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  Tom(ADMIN) on Sun Oct 23, 2011 4:44 pm

    Hmm...I've just bought one of those..
    avatar
    david f
    AMS Treasurer

    Posts : 1888
    Join date : 2010-11-10
    Age : 67
    Location : Cumbria

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  david f on Sat Oct 29, 2011 4:02 pm

    I've sent some feedback to the supplier and hopefully manufacturer.

    A long shot but let's see what their response is.

    (They may be surprised to find out where their products end up!)

    Will let you know.

    Sponsored content

    Re: Pumps (geared variety)

    Post  Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Sat Sep 23, 2017 9:04 pm